posted by Karl Hamilton on july 31, 1997 at 21:23:06:

in reply to: re: litespeed 6/4 ti posted by jon on july 31, 1997 at 20:09:45:

Jon,

Are you a Merlin dealer or Merlin employee? I don't want you to feel that I am putting you down, but a 20,000 psi advantage is indeed very significant. 6/4 ti also has greater yield strength which would serve useful in frame design.

Ultimately, your greatest error was stating that if a Litespeed Vortex were to break, it would probably be along the seam. Nope, any frame (Merlins included) are most likely to break at the points of most stress (head tube-down tube junction, or down tube-bottom bracket junction). Trust me, the seam is not a critical stress riser along the tubing.

How do I know this? Well, because I am a mech. engineer (and Vortex owner) who has worked extensively with seamed and seamless titanium in aerospace apps (which come under alot more stress than any bicycle). You know what we find? The tubing generally doesn't fail (seamless or seamed).

Face it everyone, both Litespeeds and Merlins are excellent bikes that will likely last a lifetime. 6/4 titanium is the next step up from 3/2.5. If you are looking for cutting edge, 6/4 (seamless or seamed) is ahead of 3/2.5. I'm pretty sure that Merlin's comments against Litespeeds 6/4 are due to Merlin's current lack of a 6/4 frame. If it were the other way around, Litespeed would probably do the same.

Litespeed & Merlin, 2 great bikes, 2 great companies.

Good riding, Karl

: 6-4 ti is a great material with a tensil stregth of around 130,000 psi. and most of the solid pieces on ti bikes are made of this (dropout, brake posts,cable stops and some bottom braket shells) BUT with only a 20,000 psi advantage over 3-2.5 and the fact that the 6-4 tubes all bikes made currently are rolled and welded (just like huffy's gag!) This is hardly worth the extra expense and not a very noticable improvement. the tubing will PROBABLY never break but if it does it will most likely be because of the seam.

: keep the rubber side down
: Jon
: Moonlight Cycles

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subject: re: re: re: litespeed 6/4 ti

comments:
: Jon, : Are you a Merlin dealer or Merlin employee? I don't want you to feel that I am putting you down, but a 20,000 psi advantage is indeed very significant. 6/4 ti also has greater yield strength which would serve useful in frame design. : Ultimately, your greatest error was stating that if a Litespeed Vortex were to break, it would probably be along the seam. Nope, any frame (Merlins included) are most likely to break at the points of most stress (head tube-down tube junction, or down tube-bottom bracket junction). Trust me, the seam is not a critical stress riser along the tubing. : How do I know this? Well, because I am a mech. engineer (and Vortex owner) who has worked extensively with seamed and seamless titanium in aerospace apps (which come under alot more stress than any bicycle). You know what we find? The tubing generally doesn't fail (seamless or seamed). : Face it everyone, both Litespeeds and Merlins are excellent bikes that will likely last a lifetime. 6/4 titanium is the next step up from 3/2.5. If you are looking for cutting edge, 6/4 (seamless or seamed) is ahead of 3/2.5. I'm pretty sure that Merlin's comments against Litespeeds 6/4 are due to Merlin's current lack of a 6/4 frame. If it were the other way around, Litespeed would probably do the same. : Litespeed & Merlin, 2 great bikes, 2 great companies. : Good riding, Karl : : 6-4 ti is a great material with a tensil stregth of around 130,000 psi. and most of the solid pieces on ti bikes are made of this (dropout, brake posts,cable stops and some bottom braket shells) BUT with only a 20,000 psi advantage over 3-2.5 and the fact that the 6-4 tubes all bikes made currently are rolled and welded (just like huffy's gag!) This is hardly worth the extra expense and not a very noticable improvement. the tubing will PROBABLY never break but if it does it will most likely be because of the seam. : : keep the rubber side down : : Jon : : Moonlight Cycles

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